#27 Sonia Spil - Doctors Get Women’s Hormones WRONG (Here’s the Truth)
vitalityPRO
#27 Sonia Spil - Doctors Get Women’s Hormones WRONG (Here’s the Truth)
Sonia is a seasoned online health coach with nearly a decade of experience, specialising in autoimmune conditions and hormone dysfunction, including fertility, PCOS, and other metabolic imbalances. Her journey began in the competitive world of bodybuilding as a bikini competitor, but personal health struggles reshaped her approach to coaching.
After being diagnosed with Hashimoto’s, amenorrhea, and recurring SIBO, Sonia battled unexplained weight gain, weight loss resistance, and metabolic dysfunction. Despite trying hormone replacement therapy (HRT), her symptoms and lab results remained stagnant, leading to significant cellular dysfunction and frustration. It wasn’t until she discovered VIDAL Coaching’s transformative Flush process that she experienced a breakthrough. Over the course of a year, she restored her cycle, sent Hashimoto’s into remission, and regained her energy—all without relying on medications.
Now, as a coach, Sonia specialises in helping women navigate autoimmune disorders, hormone imbalances, and metabolic dysfunction. Whether it’s supporting fertility, addressing PCOS, or guiding clients through thyroid dysfunction, she uses an evidence-based, functional health approach to create personalised, sustainable solutions. Her mission is to help women break free from the frustration of conventional protocols and reclaim their health with the same strategies that transformed her own life.
> During our discussion, you’ll discover:
(00:05:26) What are hormones
(00:12:36:16) How much do hormones fluctuate throughout the menstrual cycle
(00:14:51:04) The menstrual cycle
(00:24:42:12) Does birth control affect how women perceive potential partners
(00:29:59:19) How should women structure their exercise around their period
(00:34:18:08) Why are female health issues becoming more prevalent
(00:44:39:17) How much does stress affect women’s health
(00:51:50:18) What are the main drivers of infertility in women
(00:58:13) How Vidal coaches address female health issues
(01:06:06:16) HRT in women
(01:21:28:16) The biggest women’s health myth
(01:21:41:20) The biggest mistake women make with their health
(01:21:51:09) One nutrient every woman should focus on
(01:22:21:04) The best stress relief strategies for women
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Transcript
Welcome to the VP Life Podcast, the show
Speaker:where we bring you actionable health
Speaker:advice from leading minds.
Speaker:I'm your host, Rob. My guest today is
Speaker:Sonia Spill.(...) Sonia, a bodybuilding
Speaker:prep coach turned functional medicine
Speaker:nutritionist, works with women to help
Speaker:them overcome complex immune and
Speaker:metabolic health concerns.
Speaker:Expect to learn what hormones are and
Speaker:their roles in female physiology,
Speaker:why hormone replacement theory isn't the
Speaker:cure all it's promised to be, and how
Speaker:Sonia works as women to help them lose
Speaker:weight and reclaim their lives.(...) Now,
Speaker:on to the conversation with Sonia Spill.
Speaker:Hey, Sonia, thanks for joining us today.
Speaker:It's Saturday, I know, and you have a
Speaker:growing family. So I appreciate you
Speaker:taking the time out of your morning to
Speaker:talk to us. It's a topic I'm passionate
Speaker:about and one I know you're passionate
Speaker:about too, and that being women's health,
Speaker:of course.(...) Now, I'm fairly familiar
Speaker:with you, having worked with you in the
Speaker:past.(...) Sorry, you
Speaker:had to put up for me.
Speaker:However, I know some of our audience
Speaker:likely will benefit from getting to know
Speaker:you just a little bit better in your
Speaker:story. So yeah, shoot, if you could just
Speaker:fill us in with who you are.
Speaker:Yeah, so my name is Sonia Spill, and I am
Speaker:a functional health coach in the United
Speaker:States. I work with clients all over the
Speaker:world,(...) Dubai, Australia, UK, all
Speaker:through the United States, South America.
Speaker:We,
Speaker:meaning at Vital Coaching, the company I
Speaker:work for, we sort of pride ourselves in
Speaker:working with some of the toughest cases.
Speaker:And I was originally one of those
Speaker:toughest cases, tough cases, when I came
Speaker:over to Vital.(...) I spent a lot of my
Speaker:years in fitness. I was competing in
Speaker:women's bikini division bodybuilding. So
Speaker:I did that for a couple of years, and it
Speaker:really takes a toll on your body. And as
Speaker:I was coming out of competing, I started
Speaker:to realize how much dysfunction I had,
Speaker:even the years prior to going in. I
Speaker:realized that there was a lot of things
Speaker:like chronic bloating, loss of period,
Speaker:(...) chronic hair loss, hypothyroidism,
Speaker:that at 25, 26, a woman
Speaker:really shouldn't be experiencing.
Speaker:And even post-competing when my food came
Speaker:back up and I got body fat back on my
Speaker:body, none of it really improved. I
Speaker:actually had it go on full HRT, none of
Speaker:that worked. I had chronic inflammation.
Speaker:(...) I had what we consider overactive
Speaker:immune disorder, which I'm happy to
Speaker:explain a little bit, which is just
Speaker:chronic immunological sort of
Speaker:inflammation inside of the body. And it
Speaker:doesn't always have an easy diagnosis
Speaker:because you can't
Speaker:visually see it on labs.
Speaker:Hypothyroidism is when your thyroid is
Speaker:low, you can visually see that on labs
Speaker:and you can see some autoimmune
Speaker:conditions, but not all on labs. And I
Speaker:really struggled for about four years
Speaker:until I came for vital coaching. Me being
Speaker:a coach myself, I had kind of seen some
Speaker:clients go through similarities, nothing
Speaker:as extreme as I was going through, but it
Speaker:wasn't really until I came over, I
Speaker:started understanding the depth in which
Speaker:my body had had dysfunction,
Speaker:right? We kind of see this,
Speaker:like we talk about root cause and I know
Speaker:you've heard this term and I know people
Speaker:listening have heard that that's the root
Speaker:cause. And it's like, oh, the root cause
Speaker:of this fatigue is hypothyroidism. It's
Speaker:like, but what's the root cause of the
Speaker:hypothyroidism gut issues? Well, it's
Speaker:like, but deeper than that, where did the
Speaker:gut issues come from? Immunological
Speaker:dysfunction inside of the gut. And at
Speaker:vital, we really go down to those levels
Speaker:and I had never had somebody go to those
Speaker:levels with me before. And that's where
Speaker:the healing really began. And obviously
Speaker:it was completely blown away. I already
Speaker:being a bodybuilding coach myself really
Speaker:saw a gap in the industry to combine
Speaker:physique athletes and hormonal
Speaker:dysfunction healing and, you
Speaker:know, some sort of endocrine
Speaker:jump-starting if you will,
Speaker:post-competing. And I came to the Academy
Speaker:that we have through vital called
Speaker:Metabolic Mentor University and started
Speaker:training through that program. In
Speaker:addition to the nutrition training I had
Speaker:already been doing with my clients.(...)
Speaker:And that's when I was in, Vince and I had
Speaker:kind of connected and came over and now I
Speaker:work under Vince Pistic, who's the owner
Speaker:of Vital Coaching. Him and I work
Speaker:together to run the Priority Select
Speaker:Program, which is where we deal with some
Speaker:of the toughest cases
Speaker:really in the world.
Speaker:For anything from the stuff we're going
Speaker:to be talking about today, perimenopause,
Speaker:amenorrhea, fertility issues, to
Speaker:Hashimoto's, Lyme disease, lupus, you
Speaker:name it. We pretty much deal with it. So
Speaker:that is a little bit about my journey.
Speaker:Yeah, it's an amazing one. Thank you. I
Speaker:think if you spend enough time on forums
Speaker:like Reddit and it can start to feel a
Speaker:bit overwhelming. It just seems like
Speaker:nobody ever actually gets better. Of
Speaker:course, that's a pretty skewed
Speaker:perspective and people who are oftentimes
Speaker:posting those comments are the ones who
Speaker:are still sick, whereas people who have
Speaker:stopped posting obviously have gotten
Speaker:better, but you don't hear about people
Speaker:who get better, just the ones who are
Speaker:still unwell. So what I mean is obviously
Speaker:that there's a sort of statistical bias
Speaker:there.(...) But the point is evidently
Speaker:you are able to work through your issues
Speaker:and it's amazing to hear. And obviously,
Speaker:Vital is something we'll talk about a
Speaker:little more in a bit.
Speaker:Anyway, as I mentioned today, what I
Speaker:really want to pick up your brain about
Speaker:is women's health.(...) There's obviously
Speaker:a lot to unpack and generally what I like
Speaker:to do before getting into the nitty
Speaker:gritty of the conversation is to start
Speaker:breaking down some of the sort of complex
Speaker:physiology that sort of underpins the
Speaker:rest of the conversation.
Speaker:It also makes a great real
Speaker:and short. So that's a win.
Speaker:Anyway, I think a great place to start
Speaker:would be to really sort of at a high
Speaker:level, break down what hormones are. I
Speaker:mean, I think there are term that get
Speaker:thrown around a lot and ultimately
Speaker:they're just signaling molecules. But I
Speaker:think people look at them as purely these
Speaker:sorts of things that are involved in
Speaker:reproduction and maybe, as
Speaker:you alluded to earlier, thyroid.
Speaker:And that's it.
Speaker:I could rant on about it myself, but I
Speaker:think you do a far more eloquent job of
Speaker:highlighting exactly what they are. So
Speaker:could you just... You'll try.
Speaker:Yeah. Sort of break down
Speaker:what these molecules are.
Speaker:Yeah, absolutely. So you really nailed
Speaker:it. I always say it very easy to
Speaker:understand level hormones or messages. If
Speaker:you think about the postal system, we get
Speaker:a message, we get a piece of mail in the
Speaker:mailbox, we read it. It's like, oh, it's
Speaker:time for a doctor's visit. It creates a
Speaker:reaction for us to act on something.
Speaker:Right. Oh, this bill is due. Now we have
Speaker:to pay the bill. Oh, it's a letter. We
Speaker:feel joy. Oh, it's a Christmas card. We
Speaker:feel excited. These are messages that we
Speaker:receive. Right. And inside of the body,
Speaker:there are these same messages. And when
Speaker:one gets sent and received, it triggers
Speaker:the body in a response. It tells the body
Speaker:something. And we can have dysfunction on
Speaker:all sorts of levels, but really when it
Speaker:comes down to it, women's health,
Speaker:metabolism, mood, energy levels, they're
Speaker:all really tied to hormone balance and
Speaker:key hormones for women and men, but
Speaker:estrogen, progesterone and testosterone,
Speaker:they fluctuate cyclically throughout a
Speaker:month and they really influence how women
Speaker:feel, how women function and how they
Speaker:even metabolize nutrients, which we've
Speaker:talked about a lot just one on one about
Speaker:sort of nutrient uptake being very
Speaker:different depending on hormonal function.
Speaker:You know, when it comes to estrogen, it's
Speaker:actually estrogens. They're like three
Speaker:sisters and they work
Speaker:synergistically together.
Speaker:But how estrogens work in the body is
Speaker:they really are. Their main roles are
Speaker:growth and maintenance of reproductive
Speaker:tissues. They support bone density,
Speaker:cardiovascular health, muscle building.
Speaker:They promote healthy mood. They enhance
Speaker:serotonin, dopamine activity. They boost
Speaker:insulin sensitivity, meaning that your
Speaker:body is able to sort
Speaker:of use glucose better.
Speaker:It really helps with what we call
Speaker:carbohydrate metabolism, but it's
Speaker:basically how easy is it for you to gain
Speaker:weight from eating carbs, which is why in
Speaker:perimenopause, estrogen declines. You see
Speaker:that insulin insensitivity increase.
Speaker:And like I said, really the influence on
Speaker:mood, energy, metabolism, like when you
Speaker:have low estrogen, you'll typically be
Speaker:more depressed. You could be more
Speaker:anxiety-ridden. It really does help
Speaker:sharpen cognitive function. So when we
Speaker:see a decline in estrogens, we see
Speaker:cognitive function decline as well. This
Speaker:can happen in men and females. You know,
Speaker:estrogen plays such an important role in
Speaker:men as well. I think sometimes we think,
Speaker:oh, estrogen is bad in men or we hear
Speaker:estrogen dominance. We just think
Speaker:crushing estrogen is the way to prevent
Speaker:cancer and do all these things. And it
Speaker:really has one of the most vital roles
Speaker:inside of the body. Single-handedly, I
Speaker:think for women, estrogen is one of the
Speaker:master modulators really because it
Speaker:affects so much and the decline in
Speaker:estrogen specifically is where you hear,
Speaker:you see that big shift in perimenopause.
Speaker:Yes, higher estrogen, you know, can cause
Speaker:issues and we can talk about that later
Speaker:on when we dive in more. And then you
Speaker:have estrogen sister progesterone and
Speaker:this is kind of like our calming hormone,
Speaker:right? And progesterone, the primary
Speaker:roles are really to support pregnancy,
Speaker:(...) really prepare the uterine lining,
Speaker:balance the effects of estrogen. So we
Speaker:really wanted to yin and yang very well
Speaker:together. It promotes more of a calming
Speaker:anti-anxiety effect. So it really works
Speaker:with interacting with GABA receptors.
Speaker:It's more calming, stabilizing can really
Speaker:help promote better sleep quality.
Speaker:It does slow metabolism and can decrease
Speaker:insulin sensitivity, meaning when
Speaker:progesterone is highest around ovulation
Speaker:and the luteal phase, which we'll talk
Speaker:about, you might be more sensitive to
Speaker:carbs. Like you're not able to process
Speaker:them as well. Does that mean you should
Speaker:need them? No, you still need carbs and
Speaker:we'll talk about all that. But it really
Speaker:is interesting to see that when estrogen
Speaker:is in its peak phase, you're really just
Speaker:able to perform better. You're really
Speaker:able to eat more carbohydrates, glucose
Speaker:metabolism is at its optimal levels. And
Speaker:then when progesterone is really running
Speaker:the show, it's not necessarily the
Speaker:complete opposite, but it definitely
Speaker:slows down that process.(...) So things
Speaker:to consider when we're talking about
Speaker:cycle, I'll dive into this a little bit
Speaker:more when we talk about the luteal phase
Speaker:and the menstrual phase. But it is
Speaker:interesting to see how they work so well
Speaker:together, but they have such vast roles
Speaker:inside of the body. And
Speaker:then we have testosterone.
Speaker:Testosterone for women is just as
Speaker:important for men. I would say for men
Speaker:testosterone is their vitality hormone.
Speaker:For women, estrogen is our vitality
Speaker:hormone, but testosterone still plays a
Speaker:massive role in libido, muscle growth,
Speaker:maintaining lead muscle mass,
Speaker:just kind of like mood as well. It really
Speaker:can increase motivation and energy.
Speaker:And again, helps maintain higher
Speaker:metabolism through muscle maintenance. So
Speaker:the more muscle you have, the
Speaker:higher your metabolism as well.
Speaker:And you know, it's always so, I don't
Speaker:know if you remember the movie Fantasia.
Speaker:Do you remember the Disney movie Fantasia
Speaker:and Mickey Mouse? He was like an orange
Speaker:tree, right? And he was like always
Speaker:controlling these things. That's sort of
Speaker:what's happening. Women's hormones are
Speaker:changing every five to seven days.
Speaker:Really, we're having these
Speaker:huge shifts and fluctuations.
Speaker:You know, they all really work together.
Speaker:Like I said, estrogen and progesterone,
Speaker:they balance each other. Estragen is
Speaker:energizing and mood lifting and
Speaker:progesterone is calming and stabilizing.
Speaker:And when we have an imbalance in those
Speaker:levels, you see more mood swings,
Speaker:anxiety, irritability. This is where
Speaker:you'll hear more like
Speaker:PMS symptoms happening.
Speaker:And together, like I said, all three of
Speaker:these hormones, testosterone,
Speaker:progesterone, estrogen, they move
Speaker:throughout.(...) And so if you're cool
Speaker:with us just moving over, we can dive
Speaker:into menstrual cycles as well.
Speaker:Oh, yeah. No, all I was going to sort of,
Speaker:that was great. Thank you. I'd sort of,
Speaker:I'd love to sort of ask a quick question
Speaker:first, though.(...) How, I mean,
Speaker:obviously estrogen and progesterone are
Speaker:the main two hormones in a women's cycle
Speaker:that are regulated. How much does
Speaker:testosterone in particular
Speaker:fluctuate within that cycle?
Speaker:Yeah, so we really have more, I would say
Speaker:testosterone is more of the most stable
Speaker:in the menstrual cycle, but it does
Speaker:fluctuate around ovulation. So it's sort
Speaker:of moderate in the luteal phase.(...) I
Speaker:always say halftime, showtime, ovulation,
Speaker:it'll come up and then it'll come back
Speaker:down and it can be a little bit lower
Speaker:towards the end of cycle.(...) Now,(...)
Speaker:if you have endocrine disorders, PCOS,
Speaker:some of these other symptoms, it might
Speaker:actually be a higher fluctuation in
Speaker:changing that can prevent the signaling
Speaker:in the body's ability to release an egg,
Speaker:which we'll talk about more with PCOS,
Speaker:but it is the most stable of the women's
Speaker:hormones. Like it's the one that we don't
Speaker:have to worry about kind of the rising
Speaker:and changing quite as much. We have a
Speaker:strong increase around ovulation, which
Speaker:can sometimes cause more like acne. Women
Speaker:will say, oh, you know, I'm breaking out.
Speaker:Sometimes that can be a steep rise in
Speaker:testosterone, but for the
Speaker:most part, it's the most stable.
Speaker:Yeah, that was a perfect explanation.
Speaker:Thank you. The only thing I would add to
Speaker:that is to sort of question the notion
Speaker:that these hormones are sort of gender
Speaker:specific and as you alluded to yourself,
Speaker:you get like people will talk about male
Speaker:hormones and female hormones. And it does
Speaker:drive me a bit daily because we all have
Speaker:these hormones just in
Speaker:varying ratios and amounts.
Speaker:Obviously men, as you alluded to, are
Speaker:generally speaking more
Speaker:testosterone-driven and women or
Speaker:estrogen-driven. And the way I like to
Speaker:explain it is that fundamentally these
Speaker:hormones aren't gender specific. They
Speaker:just drive development of sexual
Speaker:characteristics associated with those
Speaker:genders. So estrogen will
Speaker:drive more breast development.
Speaker:Yeah, and those sorts of characteristics.
Speaker:Yeah, Sonia, I'd love it if you could
Speaker:sort of maybe we could transition on to
Speaker:talk about the menstrual cycle.
Speaker:Again, it's something I just mentioned a
Speaker:lot, but I don't think,
Speaker:well, most men have no clue what it is,
Speaker:which is important to know, especially if
Speaker:you're in a relationship. It helps you to
Speaker:understand your partner just
Speaker:a little bit more effectively.
Speaker:But also, I think it's going to be fairly
Speaker:critical to the rest of our conversation.
Speaker:So could you just run us through the
Speaker:basics of the menstrual cycle and the
Speaker:four phases thereof?
Speaker:Yeah, absolutely. I think this is really
Speaker:important to understand because you said
Speaker:a really great thing. Most men don't
Speaker:understand it, but I would almost
Speaker:challenge that thought. Most women don't
Speaker:even understand that. I have an e-book
Speaker:and maybe we can link it. It's a free PDF
Speaker:e-book about mastering your menstrual
Speaker:cycle because I talk to women all the
Speaker:time. And I have to explain to them, "Oh,
Speaker:this is where you're on your cycle. Can I
Speaker:explain to you what that means?" And they
Speaker:had no idea that that influenced that
Speaker:much from digestion to mood to sex drive
Speaker:to skin conditions. It really plays a
Speaker:huge role. And when you understand it,
Speaker:there are so many aha moments. And I
Speaker:don't think, and it's kind of hard to
Speaker:compare UK and US education, but in the
Speaker:US, we don't really explain the menstrual
Speaker:cycle. We just know it happens either
Speaker:line and shed. We don't know what's going
Speaker:on. And so when we break it down, like
Speaker:you said, into four phases, we really
Speaker:have, we have what's called the
Speaker:follicular phase. And that would be
Speaker:between days one and 13. The hormone
Speaker:that's rising during
Speaker:this time is estrogen.
Speaker:So estrogen is, like we said, it's going
Speaker:to, it's going to be, you're more of an
Speaker:italian hormone, typically more creative
Speaker:during this time,(...) less anxiety.
Speaker:You're feeling stronger, better glucose
Speaker:metabolism, progesterone is lower during
Speaker:this time. Digestion might even be better
Speaker:during this time. You're more optimistic.
Speaker:You're like, I'm going to go out and I'm
Speaker:going to, this is where you're like
Speaker:brainstorming. You're like, why do I feel
Speaker:so creative all the time? We'll check
Speaker:where you're at in your cycle.
Speaker:Higher, like I said, higher insulin
Speaker:sensitivity, better for more intense
Speaker:workouts, even if you're like hit
Speaker:training. But again, you'll feel stronger
Speaker:during this time as well.
Speaker:Ovulation is typically depending on
Speaker:female between days 12 and 15. It can
Speaker:fluctuate in there, which is important to
Speaker:know to prevent pregnancy, but really
Speaker:estrogen peaks during this time and
Speaker:testosterone surges. So that's why you
Speaker:can see a strong increase in sex drive,
Speaker:motivation, endurance strength during
Speaker:this time as well. And then metabolism is
Speaker:again at its all time highest during
Speaker:ovulation. This is where you can actually
Speaker:like get away with eating more even if
Speaker:you're in a deficit or a dieting phase.
Speaker:Have ovulation time be your refeed time
Speaker:or where you're going out and having a
Speaker:free meal or doing something like that
Speaker:because your body's going to utilize it
Speaker:so much better and you're going to be at
Speaker:peak performance. So it's again really
Speaker:good time for strength training. If
Speaker:you're going to do hit training, this is
Speaker:where you want to put it around your
Speaker:cycle. And then the luteal phase is what
Speaker:comes after that. This is where I'd say
Speaker:all the magic really happens in the first
Speaker:14 days. And it's the second 14 days that
Speaker:really can be a little bit hard.(...)
Speaker:When you're going into the luteal phase.
Speaker:So the first thing to remember too is
Speaker:after any strong increase in hormones, a
Speaker:sudden drop off is always going to feel
Speaker:much more abrasive if you will. And so as
Speaker:you enter the luteal phase, there is a
Speaker:strong drop off in the hormones and it
Speaker:really kind of almost crashes down, which
Speaker:can create more of like almost a stress,
Speaker:depressed, maybe more melancholy feeling,
Speaker:maybe a decrease in sex drive around this
Speaker:time for a day or two. And then hormones
Speaker:really start to rise in the second phase.
Speaker:And if you sort of think about to give
Speaker:listeners a visual, when we ovulate, we
Speaker:are focal drops. And so we have this sort
Speaker:of like outer fluffy shell and an egg is
Speaker:released. This outer fluffy shell is the
Speaker:Corpius lutum. It's sort of the modulator
Speaker:for progesterone. And if you don't have
Speaker:ovulation, you don't have the
Speaker:progesterone created because you don't
Speaker:have that fluffy outer shell. And
Speaker:honestly, even in pregnancy, that fluffy
Speaker:outer shell will stay until, you know,
Speaker:middle of the first trimester. And that's
Speaker:what's creating the progesterone to
Speaker:really secure the pregnancy.
Speaker:That is different in so many women. And
Speaker:the more stressed you are,
Speaker:the less of a response you might have an
Speaker:ovulation or if you're under eating
Speaker:chronically. And if that ovulation
Speaker:doesn't happen and that Corpius luteum
Speaker:isn't created, you won't have a rapid
Speaker:increase in progesterone. And you will
Speaker:have a rapid increase in anxiety during
Speaker:the second phase. And that's really a
Speaker:drop off in GABA. Exactly. Yes. 100%. And
Speaker:our neurotransmitters are, look, we could
Speaker:dive into that in a whole other podcast.
Speaker:They are who we are. They influence who
Speaker:we are from how we react to situations,
Speaker:how we feel about the world. And this is
Speaker:where you might even feel like more,(...)
Speaker:do I want to be in this relationship? Do
Speaker:I like my job? Like you start to question
Speaker:things and you don't know why suddenly
Speaker:you're questioning them. Look where
Speaker:you're at in your cycle. You're like, how
Speaker:I just ovulated. My hormones are coming
Speaker:down. That's what's going on.
Speaker:Yeah, it's got to let you finish the
Speaker:world on a tangent. So let me. Yeah.
Speaker:So both hormones kind of come crashing
Speaker:down and then we start to have this rise
Speaker:from in progesterone. And the
Speaker:progesterone rising is in the body is
Speaker:thinking, okay, if I am, if I am, if
Speaker:there was sperm and we are impregnated,
Speaker:the progesterone is going to rise to hold
Speaker:that pregnancy. It figures out by day 28
Speaker:that you're not pregnant and it comes
Speaker:crashing down and there's no there's no
Speaker:need to keep creating it. And that
Speaker:triggers the response
Speaker:of the menstruation.
Speaker:But during the luteal phase again,
Speaker:initially calm or stable than maybe a
Speaker:little bit more anxious moody irritable
Speaker:again. This is where you'll start to see
Speaker:in the later luteal phase when hormones
Speaker:come down again for the decline, which
Speaker:triggers the menstruation more anxiety,
Speaker:trouble sleeping, reduced insulin
Speaker:sensitivity. This is typically where you
Speaker:will see also a slowdown in digestion.
Speaker:I'll hear clients say, oh, I don't know
Speaker:what it is. It's something I'm eating,
Speaker:but sometimes it's fine. And then
Speaker:sometimes I'm backed up or I'm more
Speaker:gassy. And I would almost challenge
Speaker:people to say, well, note that where that
Speaker:gassiness is happening around your
Speaker:menstrual cycle, because in the luteal
Speaker:phase, it's very common to feel slowed
Speaker:down in digestion because the increase in
Speaker:progesterone slows down motility. And
Speaker:then you have a decrease in insulin
Speaker:sensitivity. You could be holding more
Speaker:water as well. This is where you're like,
Speaker:why did I love myself 10 days ago? And I
Speaker:look in the mirror and I just have the
Speaker:worst things to say about myself, which
Speaker:women do or like, wait, I just wore this
Speaker:dress 10 days ago and I loved it and now
Speaker:I put it on and I literally can't even
Speaker:look at myself in the mirror. Like these
Speaker:feelings that you're feeling, women
Speaker:listening, they're normal. Like they are
Speaker:happening for a reason. You're not crazy.
Speaker:Your hormones are changing your body
Speaker:ever. So I mean, if you really think
Speaker:about hormones changing this month, this
Speaker:much in just one month, it's a lot. And
Speaker:so understanding what's going on, you can
Speaker:have a little bit less of a reactive
Speaker:response to a lot of situations and you
Speaker:can have more response looking at
Speaker:yourself. Is this something that I'm
Speaker:feeling internally and not an external
Speaker:situation that's making me feel this way?
Speaker:And sometimes when we can stop and go,
Speaker:oh, I just ovulated. I don't hate my job.
Speaker:I don't not like this person. I'm fine.
Speaker:I'm just going to sit in these feelings
Speaker:for a minute. It'll pass and you won't be
Speaker:so reactive to life.(...) So there really
Speaker:are so many benefits in
Speaker:understanding your cycle.
Speaker:Like I said, luteal phase, better time
Speaker:for a little bit higher fat, diet, more
Speaker:like yoga, long walks, going for a hike,
Speaker:still strength training, but not
Speaker:necessarily hit training during this
Speaker:time.(...) Really nurturing your
Speaker:recovery, nurturing self-care during this
Speaker:time. And then we go into the
Speaker:menstruation phase, which is some people
Speaker:say it's the end of the cycle. It's
Speaker:actually the beginning of the cycle.
Speaker:And that is really days one through like
Speaker:five through one through six, depending
Speaker:on who you are and what your cycle is
Speaker:like. This is where all hormones are low,
Speaker:low estrogen, low progesterone. And then
Speaker:it's kind of the end as your estrogen
Speaker:goes up, your cycle will decrease in
Speaker:blood flow and it will normally get a
Speaker:little bit darker. And that's where your
Speaker:energy will start to come back. This is
Speaker:typically where your low energy because
Speaker:hormones are so low, potentially more
Speaker:fatigued, kind of wanting to sleep, not
Speaker:wanting to leave the house.
Speaker:Lower energy can mean also lower appetite
Speaker:as well. Sometimes people will get very
Speaker:hungry at the end of their luteal phase
Speaker:and then they start their menstruation
Speaker:and they're almost like, I don't want to
Speaker:eat anything completely normal. Your
Speaker:metabolism is slowing down due to the
Speaker:little hormones. It's kind of like a
Speaker:little bit of like a taste of
Speaker:perimenopause and your body is just
Speaker:reacting that. This is where like yoga,
Speaker:walking, going to get a pedicure, a
Speaker:massage, spending times with friends is
Speaker:really sort of the most optimal during
Speaker:that time. So understanding how they
Speaker:fluctuate throughout the menstrual cycle
Speaker:can really, like I said, empower women to
Speaker:understand what's going on, how to
Speaker:optimize their nutrition, how to change
Speaker:their training around and really how they
Speaker:can look at themselves first before
Speaker:reacting to life situations.
Speaker:I have so many questions. We're not just
Speaker:throughout the script.
Speaker:So I'll talk with,
Speaker:there's been a lot of this, there's some
Speaker:data to show that women who
Speaker:are under the contraceptive pill,
Speaker:as you've just alluded to, hormones have
Speaker:this incredibly powerful bi-directional
Speaker:relationship with neurotransmitters,(...)
Speaker:which as you said, fundamentally shape
Speaker:who we are as an individual.
Speaker:And when you start messing around with
Speaker:hormones, quote, unquote, you alter your
Speaker:perspective and your
Speaker:sort of view on reality.
Speaker:I mean, you're not stoned, but you
Speaker:understand what I mean. And there is some
Speaker:data to suggest that women who are
Speaker:chronically on the pill for maybe
Speaker:controlling hormones in their respective,
Speaker:yeah, helping skin breakouts and things
Speaker:like that, then will potentially choose a
Speaker:life partner or mate, husband, et cetera,
Speaker:that they wouldn't normally do when they
Speaker:are, when they would be off the pill or
Speaker:when they meet this person, then they
Speaker:decide to have children. They transition
Speaker:off this medication, obviously, so that
Speaker:they can become pregnant. And then all of
Speaker:a sudden, their values don't change, but
Speaker:their perspective around
Speaker:that individual changes.
Speaker:Can you speak to that at all? It's
Speaker:something I've sort of, I'm not that
Speaker:well-written to that. I
Speaker:do find quite fascinating.
Speaker:Yeah, I'd love for there to be, there's,
Speaker:you know this from working in the
Speaker:industry, but women's, women's research
Speaker:is just lacking, like for so many
Speaker:reasons, you know, and there's a lot more
Speaker:perimenopause, postmenopausal research,
Speaker:and there's a lot of research when it
Speaker:comes to estrogen-based cancers. But as a
Speaker:whole, women's hormones is just an
Speaker:under-researched area. But I have heard
Speaker:this perspective from Dr. Kerry Jones
Speaker:talks about it a lot, that the decrease
Speaker:in progesterone specifically really does
Speaker:influence your mate and your attractive,
Speaker:like how attractive you are to your
Speaker:partner. And that's why I always tell
Speaker:people, like in your luteal phase, if
Speaker:you're thinking like, do I even like this
Speaker:person? The sound of them chewing is
Speaker:driving me crazy. And all of a sudden
Speaker:you're like looking at someone else, like
Speaker:don't ever react in those moments because
Speaker:it's a temporary decrease in your
Speaker:progesterone crashing. It's not how
Speaker:you're actually viewing the world. It's
Speaker:the sharp change in
Speaker:things like neurotransmitters.
Speaker:There, I'd also like to add in too, like
Speaker:there is a massive increase for both
Speaker:suicide and anxiety in women who are on
Speaker:birth control. And that has been
Speaker:published multiple times again over in
Speaker:the American psychiatric medicine
Speaker:journals. And it is kind of ignored. I
Speaker:feel like people are like, oh, the blood
Speaker:clots. And it's like, let's talk about
Speaker:the raising rates of anxiety and women
Speaker:who are on the pill and how much that
Speaker:influences people. It's a moneymaker kind
Speaker:of because if you're on the pill, now
Speaker:you're on anti-anxiety medication. It's a
Speaker:cycle, right? And so why stop the money
Speaker:train? But it really is so important to
Speaker:understand this because sometimes we are
Speaker:looking at depression and anxiety as
Speaker:something that I need a medication for.
Speaker:And there are times and places, but
Speaker:nutrient deficiencies, birth control,
Speaker:robs, not going to tangent, birth
Speaker:control, robs, a lot of vital nutrients
Speaker:from the body, a lot of B vitamins and
Speaker:folate, which can cause mood disorders.
Speaker:And then on top of that, progesterone,
Speaker:like we said, is calming. It's the one
Speaker:that helps to sleep. It reduces anxiety.
Speaker:And when you suddenly have a change where
Speaker:you're not having that hormone and you're
Speaker:not having that response in your body of
Speaker:calming, you see the world through a lens
Speaker:that you have never seen it and you don't
Speaker:understand. And your only solution is
Speaker:medication. And so I challenge people to
Speaker:look at their hormones before they look
Speaker:at their next prescription medication for
Speaker:mood disorders. I mean, bipolar, there
Speaker:are so many exceptions. But when it comes
Speaker:to anxiety and depression because
Speaker:hormones and women and men play such a
Speaker:huge role, that's always
Speaker:the route I would go first.
Speaker:Yeah, no, I couldn't agree more,
Speaker:especially with regards to your comments
Speaker:about there not being that much research
Speaker:done into women's health, especially sort
Speaker:of prior to periem and menicals.
Speaker:Obviously, I think the biggest body of
Speaker:evidence or not evidence, but research
Speaker:done there is probably a women's health
Speaker:initiative, which retrospectively is
Speaker:probably almost useless now because all
Speaker:it suggests was that if you take
Speaker:hormones, you're going to die.
Speaker:But yeah, we'll bypass that one.
Speaker:And yeah, again, I couldn't agree more. I
Speaker:think as a society, we tend to sort of go
Speaker:down this very sort of reductionist, sort
Speaker:of take this very reductionist approach
Speaker:whereby we just sort of look at things at
Speaker:the sort of the visually the lowest
Speaker:common denominator. So person is
Speaker:depressed. Well, okay. Why?
Speaker:Because serotonin is low. Okay, well,
Speaker:then let's just increase the serotonin
Speaker:and just bypass the fact that the
Speaker:person's inflamed. They have tank
Speaker:hormones. They have immune dysfunction at
Speaker:all levels. And yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, in a minute, I'd sort of like to
Speaker:sort of jump into a few more specific
Speaker:questions. But just going back to the
Speaker:menstrual cycle quickly, you did talk
Speaker:about how women should potentially train
Speaker:around their menstrual cycle.
Speaker:Obviously,
Speaker:in the context of say something like,
Speaker:yes.
Speaker:No, let me rephrase that. How would a
Speaker:woman who's potentially a professional
Speaker:athlete sort of utilize that approach? Or
Speaker:would that then go out the window when
Speaker:you're sort of taking competition into
Speaker:account? Obviously, women's cycles don't
Speaker:all match up at the same time. So how
Speaker:would you generally work with someone who
Speaker:has got athletic goals?
Speaker:Yeah, it's a really great question. And
Speaker:sometimes we have to give up to go up,
Speaker:right? What are we willing to sacrifice
Speaker:when it comes to women's
Speaker:competitive sports, gymnastics,
Speaker:cheer, bodybuilding? There is a lot of
Speaker:amenorrhea, which is lack of the
Speaker:menstrual cycle. And that happens the
Speaker:lower the body weight and the higher the
Speaker:training, the higher the stress load.
Speaker:(...) Some things you can do to prevent.
Speaker:So I do have clients that I work with who
Speaker:are training for something, but they also
Speaker:have a goal of maybe, let's say,
Speaker:fertility. And it might be not a
Speaker:short-term goal, a long-term goal in the
Speaker:next year or two. They want to get
Speaker:pregnant. And so one of the things that
Speaker:you can do that's a low-hanging fruit is
Speaker:your workout nutrition increases around
Speaker:different parts of your cycle. So we call
Speaker:it cycle sinking. It's sort of like the
Speaker:term that we use in the industry. And I
Speaker:do talk about this in the e-book as well,
Speaker:that when we have that surge in estrogen,
Speaker:we can push harder. So maybe let's say
Speaker:you're training for a marathon. When
Speaker:you're training for a marathon, you can
Speaker:do both endurance training and interval
Speaker:training. And the interval training will
Speaker:actually help with your endurance
Speaker:training long-term, and it can help get
Speaker:your minute mile time. So maybe during
Speaker:your follicular into ovulation, you're
Speaker:doing more interval, longer runs. And
Speaker:then in your luteal phase, you're doing
Speaker:more a strong increase in fats. You're
Speaker:keeping calories high enough. You're
Speaker:really making sure that you're obviously
Speaker:taking care of nutrition, but maybe
Speaker:you're going into a little bit more
Speaker:endurance runs with longer recovery.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:With food,(...) like I said,(...)
Speaker:whatever you do, protect your ovulation.
Speaker:Don't fast over ovulation. I have a lot
Speaker:of clients who fast. I'm like, we're not,
Speaker:unless we're working through like a
Speaker:severe autoimmune case, like we are not
Speaker:fasting over ovulation. It's so important
Speaker:to be eating during that time. I've
Speaker:watched women do it and it'll create
Speaker:dysfunction in their cycle. So eating
Speaker:enough and really nurturing your body
Speaker:during that time, you can push hard. Like
Speaker:your hormones are optimal for pushing,
Speaker:but you have to eat enough to support
Speaker:that as well. So really making sure
Speaker:that's in there. Some additional things
Speaker:that I really like to add in a product
Speaker:from Medigenics called Caprix, which is a
Speaker:scurm, which is basically a product that
Speaker:sort of modulates in the body different
Speaker:responses and we use them for insulin and
Speaker:inflammation and so
Speaker:many different things.
Speaker:Caprix is specifically for inflammation.
Speaker:So decreasing inflammation in the body,
Speaker:cold plunges, products like EPA, DHA,
Speaker:Omegas, anti-inflammatory diets. So
Speaker:important because if you're going to be
Speaker:training really hard, the little things,
Speaker:I always say that the little fucks don't
Speaker:matter as much if you're not pushing
Speaker:yourself, but they matter a whole lot
Speaker:more when you're going to be optimal in
Speaker:your performance. And you still have
Speaker:hormonal goals, which is to maintain
Speaker:cycle or maybe it's fertility long-term.
Speaker:And that would be micronutrients,
Speaker:minerals, hydration, all those little key
Speaker:nutrients that believe it or not make a
Speaker:huge difference in your body's ability to
Speaker:respond to stress as well. So stress
Speaker:recovery, nutrient intake, and then
Speaker:training, timing all
Speaker:come into consideration.
Speaker:Thank you for that. That was a perfect
Speaker:answer and we'll definitely link your
Speaker:ebook in the show notes.
Speaker:I think that would definitely help
Speaker:because we've covered a
Speaker:lot of information there.
Speaker:Sonia, I sort of, yeah, I won't go off on
Speaker:a tangent. I was going to ask about pro
Speaker:resolving mediators, but
Speaker:we'll do that another time.
Speaker:Anyway, okay. So talking about women's
Speaker:health, obviously you deal with a lot of
Speaker:conditions such as
Speaker:PCOS and endometriosis,
Speaker:which strangely share a lot of, share in
Speaker:etiology in the sense that,(...)
Speaker:especially if you look at it from this
Speaker:immune-centric approach. I think first
Speaker:though, before we sort of maybe dive into
Speaker:some of those specific health issues, it
Speaker:would be, it would be, it would be
Speaker:pretty, it would be a good idea to sort
Speaker:of understand why these issues are
Speaker:starting to become more and more
Speaker:prevalent. Yeah, obviously things like
Speaker:endocrine disruptors are an issue and we
Speaker:live in this sort of toxic milieu,
Speaker:which obviously doesn't help.(...) And of
Speaker:course, genetics are
Speaker:a huge factor as well.
Speaker:And then as I learned when, when working
Speaker:with you guys, blood sugar and the, and
Speaker:the dysregulation of blood glucose has a
Speaker:huge impact. But sort of beyond those,
Speaker:those particular issues, as it were, can
Speaker:you elaborate as to why you think just
Speaker:generally speaking, women are facing more
Speaker:and more of these issues?
Speaker:Yeah. So I'm so glad we're bringing this
Speaker:up because there is an increase, right?
Speaker:And conditions like PCOS, which is
Speaker:polycystic ovarian syndrome and
Speaker:endometriosis, which is where you
Speaker:basically have lesions and growth,
Speaker:estrogen-based increase, estrogen
Speaker:increases in these people as well. We've
Speaker:really seen significant increases in
Speaker:recent decades and, and decreases in
Speaker:fertility. And there's also an increase
Speaker:in weight loss resistance and a lot of
Speaker:women as well struggling to maintain, you
Speaker:know, healthy weight despite their
Speaker:dieting and exercise efforts.
Speaker:There are a lot of different reasons. And
Speaker:so I think you really nailed it. So
Speaker:environmental and one better diagnosis.
Speaker:(...) This would be awesome. You know,
Speaker:endometriosis, I still have clients
Speaker:coming down from Canada to go to New York
Speaker:to pay out a pocket to see a doctor just to get a diagnosis.
Speaker:PCOS is a little bit different. I feel
Speaker:like anytime you have a syndrome.(...) So
Speaker:a syndrome is really a cluster of
Speaker:symptoms. And so like irritable bowel
Speaker:disease is a disease. Irritable bowel
Speaker:syndrome is what they tell you when they
Speaker:don't really know what's going on. And
Speaker:they just want to slap a sticker on it,
Speaker:you know. And so PCOS can be like that.
Speaker:It has very, very textbook diagnosis, but
Speaker:you'll see people with the regular cycles
Speaker:just get slapped with PCOS. And put on
Speaker:birth control without like really doing
Speaker:ultrasounds on the ovaries,
Speaker:the right kind of testing.
Speaker:So between the two, sometimes you can see
Speaker:a difference. It's kind of hard to get an
Speaker:endo diagnosis. It's very easy to do the
Speaker:PCOS diagnosis, which is, it should
Speaker:really be the opposite.
Speaker:And so better awareness and better, that
Speaker:would be one thing, right? More awareness
Speaker:in the medical field. I
Speaker:can't even get started there.
Speaker:Environmental lifestyle issues. So you
Speaker:nailed it. Endocrine disrupting
Speaker:chemicals. So these are,(...) when we
Speaker:think about like a very easy way to
Speaker:explain this to people is imagine, you
Speaker:know, those kids games and they're like a
Speaker:square, a circle and a rectangle. And you
Speaker:put the square in the square pick and the
Speaker:rectangle, the rectangle pick, they all
Speaker:fit.(...) That is messenger. We talk
Speaker:about hormones, right?
Speaker:Those are the messages.
Speaker:Every receptor has a certain, you know,
Speaker:shape. And like
Speaker:estrogen fits in the estrogen.
Speaker:And then you put the receptor on the
Speaker:cell. These endocrine disrupting
Speaker:chemicals can go into the receptor. They
Speaker:like kind of set their set themselves.
Speaker:These chemicals are look enough like that
Speaker:they fit into the receptor, but they're
Speaker:not. This is where you'll see people who
Speaker:are like estrogen, estrogen's increasing,
Speaker:increasing, increasing, because some of
Speaker:these chemicals are sitting in the
Speaker:receptor telling the
Speaker:body to increase estrogen.
Speaker:We put these on our body, on our face, in
Speaker:our hair, on our scalp, we shampoo.(...)
Speaker:They're on my desk. They're like
Speaker:everywhere. And I watch this because
Speaker:obviously I'm very aware of this and I
Speaker:have a 10 year old daughter. And she
Speaker:loves to go to Bath and Body Works and
Speaker:like all these places and I'm like, Oh my
Speaker:gosh, this is like we can't even smell
Speaker:these smells right now. They're so bad.
Speaker:It's really hard to get a
Speaker:young girl to understand.
Speaker:Exactly what you mean.
Speaker:Yeah. Like how this affects our
Speaker:long-term, but I cannot stress enough how
Speaker:much this greatly influences fertility,
Speaker:weight gain, and hormonal function as a
Speaker:whole. It is extremely
Speaker:unregulated. Go ahead.
Speaker:And these are called
Speaker:xenoestrogens. Is that right?
Speaker:These are xenoestrogens, particularly
Speaker:this would be like BPAs, but also
Speaker:parabens can also affect the same thing.
Speaker:They go in and disrupt. The whole
Speaker:endocrine system gets dysregulated. And
Speaker:so when we talk about how much hormones
Speaker:really play a role in even the release of
Speaker:an egg menstruation, when we start to
Speaker:have dysfunction in this,(...) our body
Speaker:doesn't, our body wasn't
Speaker:meant to take in these chemicals.
Speaker:The amount of chemicals in
Speaker:the US is obviously we're no,
Speaker:extremely disreunge.
Speaker:We're not far behind.
Speaker:Yes, exactly. And so we start to see
Speaker:things like parabens, things like
Speaker:fragrance that really
Speaker:are known to protect.
Speaker:Felates, yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, felates, yeah. To not only affect
Speaker:fertility, but to also be somewhat
Speaker:carcinogenic as well.
Speaker:We do have a site that anyone can go on
Speaker:and it's for all products around the
Speaker:world and it's called the EWG. And you
Speaker:can go and it's also an app and you can
Speaker:scan your products. It'll tell you what
Speaker:they have in them. And I wouldn't say go
Speaker:out and get rid of everything, but you do
Speaker:really need to be understanding that this
Speaker:is a big deal. This isn't like I'm, I
Speaker:have a lot of tin hat things, you know,
Speaker:this is not a tin hat thing. This is very
Speaker:real. The research is there.(...) We know
Speaker:this to be true. This isn't an assumption
Speaker:like glutathione and cancer treatment.
Speaker:Like this has research. We know these
Speaker:disrupt hormones. We know this for a
Speaker:fact. And so when you're in taking these
Speaker:things as a young kid all the way
Speaker:through, you know, the creation of your
Speaker:hormones, it's very easy. You know, you
Speaker:think you're nine, 10, 11, 12, you get
Speaker:your cycle. You already have three years
Speaker:of exposure to these chemicals. When your
Speaker:cycle does come, now it's dysregulated.
Speaker:You have painful periods. Now you've
Speaker:stopped birth control on it. The hormones
Speaker:are still being dysregulated underneath
Speaker:that birth control. It can create a lot
Speaker:of issues from a young age and you'll
Speaker:start to see an increase in these issues
Speaker:from a young age when you look through
Speaker:time, which is why birth control is so
Speaker:common. Even in young females, 12, 13, 14
Speaker:is because their cycles are so painful
Speaker:and their hormonal issues are so severe
Speaker:that the only thing the doctors can
Speaker:really do rather than obviously detox or
Speaker:educate, which would be the obvious ones,
Speaker:is to put them on birth control
Speaker:completely stressful period. Now we have
Speaker:an influx in anxiety,
Speaker:depression, all these things.
Speaker:PCOS is really an androgen dominance
Speaker:issue. An estrogen or an endometriosis is
Speaker:really an estrogen dominance issue.(...)
Speaker:Both can be missed on labs. How estrogen
Speaker:is created in the body and how it's detox
Speaker:in the body aren't always tracked in
Speaker:serum levels. Estrogen can go through
Speaker:three detox phases. One is very nurturing
Speaker:and protecting and healing for the body.
Speaker:And then methylation kind of occurs to
Speaker:kind of carry it out. We have
Speaker:glucuronidation, which is where it would
Speaker:kind of be broken down inside of the gut
Speaker:and flushed out through feces. And when
Speaker:we have dysfunction in sulfation pathway,
Speaker:right? And we have dysfunctions in these
Speaker:areas, which these
Speaker:chemicals in general can throw off.
Speaker:Estrogen can recycle.(...) So instead of
Speaker:flushing out, it actually comes in and it
Speaker:kind of goes to detox and then recycles
Speaker:in the body. Kind of go to detox and then
Speaker:recycles. And genetically, this is where
Speaker:genetics plays such a big factor.
Speaker:And you have
Speaker:things like your CYP pathways and those
Speaker:really influence. Is estrogen growth
Speaker:promoting for you? If it's not, great. If
Speaker:it is, and you have an increase in
Speaker:estrogen and estrogen growth promoting,
Speaker:you are looking at an increased risk of
Speaker:endometriosis, fibroids, breast cancer,
Speaker:ovarian cancer. And that's just the heck.
Speaker:Does it mean if you have this, that you
Speaker:need to have your breasts removed or
Speaker:you're going to get cancer or you have to
Speaker:suppress your hormones? Not at all. It's
Speaker:just important to be aware of that
Speaker:because you can support detox very
Speaker:easily. It's very inexpensive.
Speaker:Supporting detox is one of the easiest
Speaker:things you can do. It's a lot easier than
Speaker:getting endometriosis surgery. But you
Speaker:don't know that until you
Speaker:really look at your genes. Yeah.
Speaker:Yeah, no, you brought up a good point
Speaker:there, disregarding the HRT, which I want
Speaker:to come back to later. But it does drive
Speaker:me nuts that so many doctors will just
Speaker:take what are those patches called? We've
Speaker:got them over here in the UK. Evangeline,
Speaker:or something like that. And they just
Speaker:give it to menopausal, a pre and post
Speaker:menopausal woman who are struggling with
Speaker:their hormones without any further
Speaker:consideration of how a woman is actually
Speaker:supposed to handle estrogen. They don't
Speaker:look at any of these sort of genetic
Speaker:potential SNPs that they may have that
Speaker:sort of indicate whether a woman can
Speaker:actually handle a large amount of
Speaker:estrogen.(...) And I think it does.
Speaker:It does drive, it is a cause of concern
Speaker:because then all of a sudden, as you
Speaker:mentioned earlier, if a woman has a
Speaker:particular disposition for the
Speaker:development of something like breast
Speaker:cancer in later life, and you just slap
Speaker:her with a large amount of estrogen in a
Speaker:cookie cutter HRT model, then all of a
Speaker:sudden you are creating a problem. And
Speaker:it's just not thought out. There's no
Speaker:reason why it shouldn't be.(...) Anyway,
Speaker:we'll come back to that later.
Speaker:I'd sort of also, I'm loving if you could
Speaker:sort of really sort of talk to the stress
Speaker:point as well. I think when we talk about
Speaker:the reasons for these conditions becoming
Speaker:more and more prevalent, picking on
Speaker:things like, yeah, like these chemicals
Speaker:in the environment is easy, like the food
Speaker:is easy. But I don't think people
Speaker:understand the role that stress plays and
Speaker:especially psychological stress. And
Speaker:ultimately, the body doesn't understand
Speaker:stress as anything more stress. So yeah,
Speaker:when you're stressed, cortisol goes up
Speaker:more, you end up with the liver pumping
Speaker:up more glucose, glycogen, and then you
Speaker:end up with that aspect of it. And yeah,
Speaker:again, our body should. So would you be
Speaker:able to speak to that as well?
Speaker:Yeah, so great point too, when cortisol
Speaker:goes up, as the body's response to fight
Speaker:or flight to get the body moving from a
Speaker:stressful or harmful situation, glucose
Speaker:is dumped into the system. When we have
Speaker:that time and time over again, we can
Speaker:have high blood sugars, high blood sugars
Speaker:create more inflammation, high blood
Speaker:sugars and insulin sensitivity or insulin
Speaker:resistance go hand in hand for PCOS. The
Speaker:higher the insulin, the more
Speaker:dysregulation and signaling into the
Speaker:ovaries that can raise an increase in
Speaker:what's called the luteinizing hormone LH,
Speaker:which will signal more testosterone,
Speaker:which will create an angiotid dominance
Speaker:area, which creates the inability for the
Speaker:female to actually ovulate.
Speaker:And rather than dropping a follicle, it's
Speaker:sort of like it's ready to drop a
Speaker:follicle and it turns into a cyst, gets
Speaker:ready to drop a follicle and turns into a
Speaker:cyst. And so polycystic, many cystic
Speaker:ovaries is where we have that cycle that
Speaker:you sort of, we just kicked off being
Speaker:stressed as one of them, where because of
Speaker:blood sugar dysregulation, LH is
Speaker:signaling higher testosterone increases,
Speaker:we can't ovulate, we have this buildup of
Speaker:cysts on the ovaries. And it creates more
Speaker:and more dysfunction, inflammation, and
Speaker:it kind of goes down the whole gamut.
Speaker:(...) Stress itself, high cortisol
Speaker:releases progester, decreases
Speaker:progesterone. Now this is for a good
Speaker:reason. When we're in a stressful
Speaker:situation, we don't want to be conceding,
Speaker:right? This is like, oh, this is, this is
Speaker:perfect. But if you want to conceive,
Speaker:this doesn't work. If you want to have a
Speaker:balanced hormone, the hormonal cycle,
Speaker:this also doesn't work because when we
Speaker:have a decrease in progesterone and an
Speaker:increase in, estrogen,(...) we have
Speaker:estrogen dominance. We have more anxiety,
Speaker:more PMDD, more PMS, higher estrogen
Speaker:means more risk of not detoxing it
Speaker:correctly. Genetic factors
Speaker:come into play here as well.
Speaker:Cortisol,(...) you know,
Speaker:stress as a whole.(...) This is always
Speaker:kind of a hard topic because I see a lot
Speaker:of Dutch testing where we can see
Speaker:cortisol in along with hormones. People
Speaker:don't even realize how stressed they are
Speaker:until you show them like a four point
Speaker:cortisol reading with the weighted
Speaker:average. Like this isn't lying to us.
Speaker:This isn't because you were scared to get
Speaker:your blood drawn.
Speaker:This is kind of a truth.
Speaker:Stress is so many things. Stress is my
Speaker:kids jumping out of the bathroom and
Speaker:scaring me. That's a stress. It's fun. I
Speaker:love it. We laugh. If my body doesn't
Speaker:always like think, oh, this is so much
Speaker:fun. I can feel the cortisol. That's like
Speaker:when you get scared and it's scary movie.
Speaker:That's that response. It's a hard
Speaker:conversation.(...) It's losing a loved
Speaker:one. It's loss of a job. It's divorce,
Speaker:but it's also not having that
Speaker:conversation in your relationship that
Speaker:you really need to be having. It's not
Speaker:setting boundaries with your friends.
Speaker:It's not setting boundaries at work. It's
Speaker:sitting in traffic. It's so, it's your
Speaker:workout. It's your training that you're
Speaker:so addicted to. That's a stressor.
Speaker:Fasting.
Speaker:Yes. Fasting can be a stressor. Under
Speaker:eating, chronic dieting. These are all
Speaker:big stressors on the body. And
Speaker:unfortunately now more than ever, in so
Speaker:many beautiful ways women are working
Speaker:more than ever. But this isn't like a
Speaker:political viewpoint, but our bodies
Speaker:weren't meant to endure. The same sort of
Speaker:stresses men's bodies are meant to
Speaker:endure. Men really
Speaker:manifest stress cardiovascularly.
Speaker:And in hair loss, like
Speaker:that's where men will show it.
Speaker:Women really, their stress really affects
Speaker:their hormones. And because as we
Speaker:discussed in the beginning, it's an
Speaker:orchestra and everyone's relying on the
Speaker:other hormones to make a change in a
Speaker:fluctuation to make the next response.
Speaker:Right? Because their messages getting
Speaker:sent that create a response inside of the
Speaker:body.(...) When that's dysfunctional, it
Speaker:triggers, it's like a domino falling,
Speaker:right? We have more immunological
Speaker:situations than ever because of hormonal
Speaker:dysfunction. Blood sugar regulation due
Speaker:to high cortisol, the immune system
Speaker:function goes up when insulin and blood
Speaker:sugar goes up as well. And we have
Speaker:immunometabolism. So we have an increase
Speaker:in the immune system up taking, which
Speaker:creates more autoimmune conditions, which
Speaker:I would argue, arguably say endometriosis
Speaker:and PCOS are immunological conditions.
Speaker:They're endocrine and immunological
Speaker:conditions. And we have so many others as
Speaker:well. We do see even postmenopausal women
Speaker:almost manifesting as autoimmune diseases
Speaker:because of the decrease in sudden drop
Speaker:off in their hormones combined with high
Speaker:stress during that time.(...) Unresolved
Speaker:trauma is a chronic stress, a low grade
Speaker:chronic stress. Unresolved infections. So
Speaker:this is a huge one. I'll see too is maybe
Speaker:you have a cavitation, not a cavity. Hear
Speaker:me out. Cavitation, which is deeper than
Speaker:that. It's in the root in between the
Speaker:tooth and the actual jaw. You can get
Speaker:little infections and their low grade.
Speaker:Maybe you'll have one or two. Your immune
Speaker:system can down regulate. It can cause
Speaker:higher blood sugars because your body's
Speaker:constantly fighting. And again, create
Speaker:this cascade of a hormonal effect. So
Speaker:there really are so many reasons, which
Speaker:is why it's important to work with
Speaker:somebody who understands and can help you
Speaker:navigate because in the world of, I mean,
Speaker:just all the things we talked about. I
Speaker:mean, somebody could be listening right
Speaker:now and be like, I'm all of those things
Speaker:and none of those things. You know,
Speaker:they're like, I relate to
Speaker:everything that you're saying.
Speaker:And I think with hormone dysfunction and
Speaker:women and hormones, each individual
Speaker:person has their own sort of like code,
Speaker:whether it's their combination of stress,
Speaker:genetics and blood sugar. But it's all
Speaker:very unique to how their blood sugar is
Speaker:raising, what kind of stress they're
Speaker:experiencing, what their dieting history
Speaker:is, what their hormonal history is. And
Speaker:so navigating sort of those four pieces
Speaker:of each women is so important in creating
Speaker:a plan to help them find sort of that
Speaker:peak optimal performance.
Speaker:I couldn't have said it better myself. I
Speaker:mean, literally, I couldn't have. That
Speaker:was amazing. Thank you. And we'll have to
Speaker:have a podcast, I think, on
Speaker:immunomatabolism at some point.
Speaker:Sonia, I'd sort of definitely like to
Speaker:maybe go into how you start resolving
Speaker:this in a little while, but first I'd
Speaker:sort of like to maybe have a discussion
Speaker:around the fertility side of things. I
Speaker:have a feeling there's going to be a lot
Speaker:of overlap here specifically because a
Speaker:lot of the issues that you've already
Speaker:mentioned, things like PCOS and
Speaker:endometriosis do
Speaker:directly affect fertility.
Speaker:But just in your practice and in your
Speaker:view, what are the, and you probably will
Speaker:have exactly the same answers again, I'd
Speaker:imagine, but what are you in your view
Speaker:are the main drivers of infertility with the women that you do see?
Speaker:Obviously,
Speaker:there's two sides to that conversation
Speaker:because there is also the male component
Speaker:there. But from the female side, what are
Speaker:the main issues that you see nowadays
Speaker:just regarding
Speaker:fertility? Yeah, fertility.
Speaker:This is such a great question that really
Speaker:a topic I'm so passionate about,
Speaker:especially being diagnosed with
Speaker:infertility for so long and I'm currently
Speaker:expecting, so we're five
Speaker:months along right now.
Speaker:Congratulations.
Speaker:Thank you. And I was diagnosed with
Speaker:premature ovarian failure 10 years ago
Speaker:and then even more recently went through
Speaker:some more testing and they were still
Speaker:like, you will have to do IVF. That is a
Speaker:guarantee. And we had an accident, not an
Speaker:accident, we're so grateful, but I mean,
Speaker:it can happen. And so that really comes
Speaker:through healing the immune system as
Speaker:well. I would say outside of the things
Speaker:we already discussed, PCOS,
Speaker:endometriosis, very basic hormone
Speaker:dysfunction, which you can see and
Speaker:doctors will catch and a fertility clinic
Speaker:will catch. Some of the most common
Speaker:missed things and we do work at Vital
Speaker:with a lot of fertility cases and a lot
Speaker:of sort of failed IVF cases is the immune
Speaker:system.(...) You know, we talked about
Speaker:the immune system in women. It's so much
Speaker:easier for the immune system to be
Speaker:overactive. We can see that. The immune
Speaker:rates in women are 70% higher than not
Speaker:immune rates in men. Now, they're
Speaker:increasing in men because of all the
Speaker:things we talked about, but there really
Speaker:is such a bigger immunological response.
Speaker:This is also the difference between a man
Speaker:flu and a woman flu. We always, oh, he
Speaker:has the man flu.(...) Well, poor thing.
Speaker:The men don't have the same immune
Speaker:systems we have. So they are actually
Speaker:that sick. Even though they have the same
Speaker:bug, you're just fighting it differently.
Speaker:Women's immune systems are chromosomes.
Speaker:They're better adaptive. They're better
Speaker:responsive and they have a better memory
Speaker:as well. And so it's a beautiful thing.
Speaker:(...) The issue is in pregnancy, it can
Speaker:become overactive and over responsive at
Speaker:times. And the body doesn't always want
Speaker:to have, you know, a fetus. It doesn't
Speaker:always want to have sperm in it and it
Speaker:can attack sperm. It can attack the egg.
Speaker:It can attack the fetus, which is why
Speaker:you'll see failed IVF is an immunological
Speaker:upregulation. We use a lot of things like
Speaker:rapamycin to sort of slow down. If you
Speaker:have on and off switches for the immune
Speaker:system to slow down without
Speaker:immunosuppressing, we use a lot of low
Speaker:dose naltroxen, which can help the body
Speaker:really prevent miscarriage by preventing
Speaker:an immunological sort of uproar when the
Speaker:body does get pregnant. And then we also
Speaker:work on really re-toggling the switches.
Speaker:So if you think about the immune system
Speaker:as a series of on and off switches, this
Speaker:is a very easy way. On and off for
Speaker:inflammation, on and off for
Speaker:responsiveness, on and off for turning
Speaker:off. We have all these switches and
Speaker:they're a part of our genes. And through
Speaker:epigenetics, which is lifestyle stress,
Speaker:endocrine, disrupting chemicals, toxins,
Speaker:mold, these genes can become more, more
Speaker:impactful. Expressed or? Yeah, yeah.
Speaker:More, I always say, kind of more
Speaker:impactful in your life than maybe if
Speaker:those weren't expressing themselves. And
Speaker:so when it comes to fertility, the immune
Speaker:system really needs to be back into a
Speaker:place of like calm. When I'm in a place
Speaker:of needing to respond, I'll respond
Speaker:versus I'm always turned on and I'm
Speaker:always fighting. And we do that through
Speaker:some fasting, through a lot of deep
Speaker:immunological work, through
Speaker:immuno-metabolism, we have, we can talk a
Speaker:little bit about vital to like, we work
Speaker:through some systems and we're addressing
Speaker:mainly immune system and hormonal
Speaker:dysfunction at the same time.
Speaker:Yeah, I fundamentally, I think that's
Speaker:that's that's ultimately, if I was to
Speaker:sort of boil it down to just one or two
Speaker:things, I would say it was, it was, it
Speaker:was high levels of stress and then just a
Speaker:rubbish environment. I think those
Speaker:potentially are the two catalysts that
Speaker:then drive this endocrine and
Speaker:immunologic, not logical dysfunction.
Speaker:Just at every level and it speaks to sort
Speaker:of, and I think it's a conversation again
Speaker:for another day, but it's where this idea
Speaker:of sort of adverse childhood events can
Speaker:also come into play. And that triggering
Speaker:the sort of this baseline immunological
Speaker:state that then sort of carries through
Speaker:through the rest of life, which then puts
Speaker:an individual at risk for the, for these,
Speaker:for these immunological
Speaker:and inflammatory issues.
Speaker:I also think it's probably worth noting
Speaker:just from a fertility point of view that
Speaker:it's obviously all of these endocrine
Speaker:disrupting chemicals are causing a lot of
Speaker:precocious puberty in young girls. And as
Speaker:you, if you're going to enter puberty
Speaker:earlier you're going to drive a run
Speaker:through your very reserve foster.(...)
Speaker:And that's obviously a component thereof
Speaker:too. I mean, if you, yeah, if you don't
Speaker:necessarily have the eggs available when
Speaker:you're trying to fall pregnant, then that
Speaker:too is something to sort of be aware of.
Speaker:(...) So yeah, it is just so multifaceted
Speaker:in this. It's why I sort of think why I'm
Speaker:such a fan of what you guys at Vital are
Speaker:doing because I can't think of anyone who
Speaker:takes such a, such a personalized and
Speaker:sort of multifaceted approach to dealing
Speaker:with these sorts of issues, which is a
Speaker:perfect segue. And I don't get that right
Speaker:often. So I'm quite proud of that one.
Speaker:And two, what you guys do at Vital and
Speaker:how you start to deal with these problems
Speaker:specifically. I mean, again, I will get
Speaker:back to you guys at some point, but
Speaker:specifically how you start to approach
Speaker:women's health issues, should we say,
Speaker:hence this being the topic
Speaker:of today's conversation. Yeah.
Speaker:And how you, yeah, you
Speaker:approach those, these issues. Yeah.
Speaker:Great question.
Speaker:I start by saying we have our 4F process,
Speaker:which is kind of like what we're known
Speaker:for, which is flush, feed, function and
Speaker:fast.(...) But I would say that it's not,
Speaker:it's not like a course where like you do
Speaker:this step and that step and that step and
Speaker:that step. We always start pretty much
Speaker:with some form of flush, whether that's a
Speaker:low histamine, bacterial,(...)
Speaker:immunological. We're working in the first
Speaker:phase of really opening up thyroid. We're
Speaker:stimulating adrenals. We're stimulating
Speaker:thyroid, stimulating adrenals, open up
Speaker:lymphatic system, opening up the kidneys,
Speaker:opening up the liver. We're really
Speaker:working on increasing food during this
Speaker:phase as well. And we actually utilize a
Speaker:lot of juices during this phase, a lot of
Speaker:micronutrients during this phase. We eat
Speaker:a lot of food. People are always like,
Speaker:oh, it's a juice. Carbs.(...) Yeah,
Speaker:carbs. It is not a juice fast. I promise
Speaker:you, you're going to be eating a lot of
Speaker:food. And we're really just pushing sort
Speaker:of a spike in insulin to drive down
Speaker:glucose and really have better glucose
Speaker:metabolism during this phase. Then we
Speaker:really go into the function phase and the
Speaker:function phase we're addressing
Speaker:underlying gut issues, leaky gut, gut
Speaker:dysfunction, SIBO or just dysbiosis,
Speaker:which is just an imbalance, which could
Speaker:just be low bacteria as well. We're
Speaker:really utilizing also what I like called
Speaker:metabolic flexibility. This is where
Speaker:we're really adjusting.
Speaker:The biggest thing for women is they get
Speaker:stuck being sugar burners. So what I mean
Speaker:is normally when you eat an apple, your
Speaker:blood sugar will go up. Two hours after
Speaker:your blood sugar goes down, this is
Speaker:called your postprandial blood sugar. And
Speaker:then it should start going down and your
Speaker:body should turn on a mild amount of
Speaker:ketones, which is where it starts burning
Speaker:fat. And then it will burn fat as energy
Speaker:until you eat again next time. And it's
Speaker:the body's natural system that occurs.
Speaker:We're born with this. This is why kids
Speaker:and young women can eat a lot more and
Speaker:maintain and not see issues because their
Speaker:body is going into a fat burning zone
Speaker:every two and a half hours. They're
Speaker:starting to burn fat again. And so that
Speaker:is how the metabolism works and how the
Speaker:body is regulated, sort of like
Speaker:homeostasis through time, inflammation,
Speaker:stress, and you name it. All the things
Speaker:we've talked about, your body sort of
Speaker:gets stuck. And through high stress, you
Speaker:eat an apple, blood sugar goes up. When
Speaker:it starts to go down because your body is
Speaker:so stressed, it doesn't want to die, it
Speaker:doesn't want to burn fat. So many
Speaker:reasons. Immune system is turned on. It
Speaker:needs to keep blood sugar side to keep
Speaker:running. Immune system runs off glucose.
Speaker:(...) It will dump glucose in the system
Speaker:to read regularly and
Speaker:blood sugars will stay high.
Speaker:And so you never get into fat burning.
Speaker:And so when you're staying in places of
Speaker:high blood sugars, you also don't get
Speaker:into deep levels of cellular healing or
Speaker:autophagy. Even when you're sleeping or
Speaker:times of resting. And when we're not
Speaker:getting through cellular cleaning, we
Speaker:really have an increase in what's called
Speaker:senescent cells. And senescent cells are
Speaker:just sort of like dysfunctional zombie
Speaker:cells, if you will, that really need to
Speaker:be cleaned up, but the body doesn't have
Speaker:the system set up to clean up those
Speaker:cells. And they release what's called
Speaker:cytokines, which create inflammation.
Speaker:(...) So in this process of the function
Speaker:phase, we work on metabolic flexibility,
Speaker:making you a sugar and a fat burner. And
Speaker:we also work on this phase of some
Speaker:cellular cleanup as well.
Speaker:We really start to introduce fasting
Speaker:around this time. We'll go through
Speaker:cyclical, maybe around cycle. Maybe we're
Speaker:doing once a week, 24 hour fast, just to
Speaker:get deep cellular cleanup. But we can't
Speaker:do that.(...) Hear me out. You cannot be
Speaker:fasting if you're not metabolically
Speaker:flexible, because what will happen is
Speaker:your fast will be a stress. Your blood
Speaker:sugars won't drop. Your ketones won't
Speaker:turn on. And you're just degrading muscle
Speaker:and you're creating a lot more havoc.
Speaker:You're wreaking havoc on your body during
Speaker:this time. So it's important to kind of
Speaker:work the system. And we have ways to
Speaker:track this. You've worked with us before.
Speaker:We're tracking glucose. We have systems
Speaker:in place to make sure we're actually
Speaker:getting the benefits before we put
Speaker:somebody into a fast.(...) From there, we
Speaker:really start. Okay. Now, now that we've
Speaker:addressed the real underlying issue,
Speaker:because the underlying issue isn't
Speaker:hormone dysfunction. It's why the hormone
Speaker:dysfunction happened. So now that we've
Speaker:addressed that, hormones by this time are
Speaker:already 10 times better. But now we can
Speaker:start really saying, okay, do we need to
Speaker:support detox better? Do we need to
Speaker:support, maybe we're going in with some
Speaker:HRT or bovines or products that stimulate
Speaker:a specific hormone to create more
Speaker:progesterone, to create more estrogen, to
Speaker:support more estrogen detox. This is our
Speaker:function phase. And so this is always
Speaker:really important. I would say this is the
Speaker:cherry on top. This is where we're
Speaker:starting to work on physique. This is
Speaker:sort of like your heel that we're locking
Speaker:you back into the real world, if you
Speaker:will. And so we work in these phases
Speaker:specifically because one needs to occur
Speaker:for the next to occur. If the body is
Speaker:toxic and toxic and loaded, it will not
Speaker:get met. It will not decrease
Speaker:inflammation, which will not drop blood
Speaker:sugars, which will not create metabolic
Speaker:flexibility. So it's this system that
Speaker:we've really niche down. Are there other
Speaker:things that work? Sure. Dr. Pompa, Living
Speaker:Well, there are so many great systems out
Speaker:there. This is the system we find, tried
Speaker:and true. We work with a lot of women on
Speaker:a very high level. We've got 15 coaches
Speaker:and our coaches see anywhere from 80 to
Speaker:60 clients. And we have guaranteed
Speaker:outcomes too in our program. We have an
Speaker:85% success rate with our women in severe
Speaker:autoimmune cases, which is massive.
Speaker:We were talking about actual healing from
Speaker:people who were told they would never be,
Speaker:these are lifelong, lifelong diagnoses.
Speaker:And they're completely recovered and
Speaker:they're living in full remission and
Speaker:they're feeling good. We don't heal. We
Speaker:don't care that these people find healing
Speaker:throughout themselves, lifestyle, stress.
Speaker:We're working a lot of mindset. We have
Speaker:our group coaching calls, which is such
Speaker:an important piece to work the
Speaker:psychological side of things alongside
Speaker:healing the body so that you can find a
Speaker:new level of living. Then you can sort of
Speaker:step out of the sick girl or guy era into
Speaker:like your strong guy or girl era or your
Speaker:fertile guy or girl era. And you can
Speaker:really sort of recover or find your
Speaker:mission from those
Speaker:situations you were dealing with.
Speaker:Yeah, no, it's a great system. And I'd
Speaker:say, and obviously I'm not getting paid
Speaker:to say this, but I think the fact that
Speaker:you deal with it at an immunological
Speaker:level is almost completely unique. I
Speaker:think most people just work upstream of
Speaker:that at a best case scenario.(...) And
Speaker:they'll just focus on sort of, as we
Speaker:alluded to at the very beginning of this
Speaker:conversation, a lot of people, well,
Speaker:practitioners, will start to look at the
Speaker:root causes being just fixing the thyroid
Speaker:or maybe just fixing the gut, but not
Speaker:looking upstream of that, not looking
Speaker:upstream, maybe not looking at the
Speaker:nervous system, not looking at the immune
Speaker:system, which is fundamentally, as we
Speaker:talked about earlier, where all these
Speaker:sort of issues sort of really start to
Speaker:come into fruition, where they start to
Speaker:develop and when they
Speaker:start to become problematic.
Speaker:So I know we're starting to run up on
Speaker:time, but I think I would be remiss if we
Speaker:didn't have a quick
Speaker:conversation about HRT.
Speaker:I know that it's, again, something we've
Speaker:discussed previously, and it's definitely
Speaker:a bit controversial,(...) especially when
Speaker:you start to sort of have the whole
Speaker:menopause
Speaker:pre-menopause conversation there.
Speaker:Whether a woman should sort of naturally
Speaker:go through menopause without HRT, or she
Speaker:should have it. And I think the same
Speaker:thing applies to men going
Speaker:through andropause as well.
Speaker:I'm personally, I'm of the opinion that
Speaker:anyone who is struggling should really
Speaker:consider HRT of any sort, whether that's
Speaker:thyroid, sex hormones, or, yeah, because
Speaker:fundamentally we need these hormones, as
Speaker:we have now established, to function as
Speaker:human beings. And it's not just about
Speaker:aesthetics,(...) and sort of libido and
Speaker:sexuality. It's about mental health, it's
Speaker:about neurological health, it's about
Speaker:cardiovascular health.
Speaker:When you're working with a client,
Speaker:obviously a woman in this case, when do
Speaker:you start to have that conversation? I
Speaker:know you generally, you're obviously not
Speaker:a medical doctor, but at Vidal do have
Speaker:medical doctors on staff
Speaker:who can prescribe hormones.
Speaker:But what are your thoughts on this, and
Speaker:when do you get to the point where you
Speaker:would advise a woman who is struggling
Speaker:with her hormones to maybe consider HRT?
Speaker:And then beyond that, I'd love to have a
Speaker:quick discussion on the Dutch test
Speaker:because, as I was talking about earlier,
Speaker:I think it's a tool that just allows you
Speaker:to fine tune an HRT protocol,
Speaker:and especially from a sort of estrogen
Speaker:clearance standpoint.
Speaker:So yeah, I'll stop nattering now and let
Speaker:you answer, but how do you go about this
Speaker:with your female clients?
Speaker:Great question. So I think you said it
Speaker:really well too. There's no need to walk
Speaker:through life suffering. There's no badge
Speaker:that says I did this without HRT or I did
Speaker:this with HRT. You don't get an award
Speaker:for, it's kind of like natural
Speaker:childbirth, you know, that's a bad,
Speaker:you're like, whoa, that lady gave birth
Speaker:naturally. No other girl, that's crazy.
Speaker:No one is like, oh, they made it through
Speaker:perimenopause without progesterone. Wow,
Speaker:they're so incredible. No, you think
Speaker:their poor husband or like their poor
Speaker:stress or their poor
Speaker:body went through so much.
Speaker:There are so many things to consider. I
Speaker:say one of the most important things is
Speaker:remember that the lab is a lab, how you
Speaker:feel is going to chunk that. I have
Speaker:plenty of women who have very low
Speaker:progesterone who are postmenopausal and
Speaker:their perimenopause, you know, they're
Speaker:cycling every four months and they feel
Speaker:great. They don't have stress. They don't
Speaker:have anxiety. They're responding to basic
Speaker:weight loss protocols. They're doing
Speaker:fine. And in the case like that, I
Speaker:wouldn't say you have to have. I'd say if
Speaker:their sleep is good and their stress is
Speaker:good and their body is functioning fine,
Speaker:that's great. A lot of how a person
Speaker:transitions through perimenopause and
Speaker:postmenopause is really based on their
Speaker:life circumstances, how much they didn't
Speaker:set boundaries, their trauma, how much
Speaker:they didn't do for themselves, like the
Speaker:stress they've had in their lives, the
Speaker:stress they currently have. I would
Speaker:argue, arguably say that, you know,
Speaker:someone who's transitioning through
Speaker:perimenopause who's a nurse and work
Speaker:night shift their whole life versus
Speaker:somebody who is a stay at home mom and
Speaker:teaches yoga. Like those are going to be
Speaker:very different outcomes
Speaker:about their transitioning.
Speaker:And we have to really understand that. So
Speaker:I think that sometimes we can get caught
Speaker:in labs and not how a person's feeling.
Speaker:And I really like to go off
Speaker:of how a person's feeling.
Speaker:I love HRT. I just think it's such a gift
Speaker:to the world for so many reasons. When it
Speaker:comes to fertility, I always like to go
Speaker:the natural route to bring it up. But I
Speaker:really do use progesterone in a lot of my
Speaker:infertile cases because some of these
Speaker:women,(...) what we don't always
Speaker:understand is getting pregnant can be
Speaker:healing to the body. You're eating more,
Speaker:hormones are higher when you haven't had
Speaker:them for so long and they can re-regulate
Speaker:in the nine months that you've had them
Speaker:again, they're re-regulating and your
Speaker:body is responding really well to them.
Speaker:So I do use progesterone in some of these
Speaker:cases and I really like to use it to
Speaker:prevent miscarriage in women who don't
Speaker:have strong ovulations
Speaker:because we want the corpus callum.
Speaker:So it's like the volume is very low and
Speaker:it's not going to create a lot of
Speaker:progesterone and it's not sure what to
Speaker:do. And when we support progesterone and
Speaker:fertility, it can really prevent
Speaker:miscarriage on a high level.(...) I've
Speaker:seen some fertility clinics, not ours, go
Speaker:up to even 400 milligrams of
Speaker:progesterone, which is a huge dose.
Speaker:I'd say it's arguably about four times
Speaker:what you normally want to use in a woman
Speaker:than a woman. And so I think it's
Speaker:beneficial there. I think when it comes
Speaker:to HRT in general, if I'm going to have a
Speaker:client who's progesterone, a basic serum,
Speaker:meaning blood test, will do.
Speaker:I normally like to do two or three
Speaker:throughout a month versus just one
Speaker:because if they're having irregular
Speaker:cycles, you don't really know what their
Speaker:surge is looking like, but you can get a
Speaker:baseline from two or three very easily.
Speaker:Like this person is not showing any signs
Speaker:of increased progesterone. If a person is
Speaker:showing increased signs of progesterone
Speaker:and their LH and FSH, which are hormones
Speaker:we look at, and sort of looking at the
Speaker:use of their, like, are they
Speaker:transitioning or not? Are they
Speaker:post-menopausal or pre-menopausal?(...)
Speaker:If everything is low, I think more
Speaker:chronic stress. And I think, let me
Speaker:address stress first. If those things
Speaker:look normal and progesterone is still
Speaker:low, I'll go into prescriptive
Speaker:progesterone, maybe 50 milligrams again.
Speaker:We don't prescribe. Our clinics do. So I
Speaker:really just let our clinics, our world
Speaker:class, take care of that. And so that's
Speaker:probably around what they would use for a
Speaker:female who's still cycling when it comes
Speaker:to estrogen, though.(...) I personally
Speaker:never like to introduce estrogen without
Speaker:a Dutch chest for the very
Speaker:reasons you spoke of earlier.
Speaker:How estrogen is in the body is really how
Speaker:it's being recycled. If it's being
Speaker:recycled, I want the faucet to be on or
Speaker:off, right? And if we think about the
Speaker:faucet is on most of our life, in
Speaker:post-peri-menopausal, it starts to turn
Speaker:down, and then in post-menopausal, the
Speaker:faucet turns off. Well, that's only the
Speaker:faucet. What about the drain? Because if
Speaker:we turn the faucet back on and the drain
Speaker:is clogged, or a person is not
Speaker:methylating, or a person is recycling
Speaker:estrogen, or their growth promoting,
Speaker:we really do create more of a risk of
Speaker:long-term issues or severe reactions,
Speaker:heavy period, inflammation, a lot of
Speaker:dysfunction. And so understanding if the
Speaker:drain is open and the recycling of that
Speaker:estrogen is cleared, it's really key. You
Speaker:know, estrogen is one of those ones where
Speaker:you really need to be...
Speaker:I don't want to say you really need to be
Speaker:careful because you don't need to be
Speaker:scared of estrogen and estrogyle. They're
Speaker:so beautiful. Like I said, they're your
Speaker:serotonin. They're your vitality. They're
Speaker:your muscle. They're your metabolism.
Speaker:They're your cardiovascular health.(...)
Speaker:But introducing a bioidentical hormone
Speaker:into the body when you don't know how
Speaker:it's going to react is something you
Speaker:really want to be cautious of. So again,
Speaker:working with the provider, getting a
Speaker:Dutch test. All over the world, you can
Speaker:get a Dutch test. They ship
Speaker:internationally.(...) And you can have a
Speaker:provider go through it, even if your
Speaker:provider doesn't. Dutch will recommend a
Speaker:provider that can give a reading on it at
Speaker:vital. We work with people all over the
Speaker:world. They do a Dutch. We just provide
Speaker:feedback on their Dutch.
Speaker:So there's a lot of different avenues
Speaker:that you can go for that.(...) When it
Speaker:comes to
Speaker:testosterone, again, how you feel.
Speaker:If a person has a history of PCOS or some
Speaker:sort of cycle dysfunction, the Dutch test
Speaker:will also show us if they favor more of
Speaker:an alpha, meaning a strong response to
Speaker:androgens, or a beta, meaning a weaker
Speaker:response to androgens. But it's not
Speaker:necessarily needed, right? Because if a
Speaker:woman is most optimal between 30 and 40
Speaker:testosterone and they're at 11, naturally
Speaker:you can get them to a 20 or even a 22.
Speaker:That's doubling their
Speaker:testosterone. It's still only a 22.
Speaker:So you might, in that case, want to
Speaker:supplement. I would say women who are,
Speaker:some women burn through hormones a lot
Speaker:more and some women are just wanting to
Speaker:perform better at the gym. They train
Speaker:hard.(...) They're 55 and they love
Speaker:lifting weights and they love being
Speaker:active and like, great, higher
Speaker:testosterone levels are
Speaker:going to help you maintain that.
Speaker:Yeah, it's really so
Speaker:dependent on a person.
Speaker:I always like to go through pros and cons
Speaker:with my clients because, again, it's very
Speaker:different with women and hormones than
Speaker:men in the sense of, for women, if you
Speaker:start testosterone and then you stop,
Speaker:you're just going to go back to where you were.
Speaker:But the man, if you start testosterone,
Speaker:then you stop, you're going to be lower
Speaker:than where you were. So you need to
Speaker:buffer that a little bit more.
Speaker:But at the end of the day, hormones are
Speaker:so protective in our body that having
Speaker:bioidentical, and I stress the
Speaker:bioidentical side, having bioidentical
Speaker:hormones in the body to support it.
Speaker:Yeah,
Speaker:brain, heart, metabolism, muscle mass are
Speaker:important. Are they required? No. But if
Speaker:you were like, I want
Speaker:to live the longest,
Speaker:vitality is important to me, cognitive
Speaker:function is important to me, preventing
Speaker:osteoporosis is important to me. I have
Speaker:great grandkids I want to be around for.
Speaker:Like then HRT, even in a low dose, would
Speaker:probably be a route
Speaker:you want to look into.
Speaker:You brought up a number of great points
Speaker:there, starting with the fact that I
Speaker:think that everybody should always first
Speaker:look to optimize their natural production
Speaker:by sort of getting to the root cause or
Speaker:whatever is behind the dysfunction of the
Speaker:hormones to begin with. And I think this
Speaker:is where functional medicine normally
Speaker:tends to fall short, is that you will go
Speaker:to your standard functional medicine
Speaker:provider and they'll just look at labs
Speaker:and say, well, your hormones are low.
Speaker:We're getting the root cause of it by
Speaker:giving you hormones. And I think what,
Speaker:unfortunately,(...) most clinicians,
Speaker:coaches in this field fail to realize is
Speaker:that that's A, not sort of getting the
Speaker:root cause the problem. And B, if you are
Speaker:trying to sort of deal with three calls
Speaker:of the problem, hormones are nine times
Speaker:out of 10, the last thing that's going to
Speaker:respond, especially if there's a lot of
Speaker:inflammation, a
Speaker:dysregulated immune system,
Speaker:a number of infections. Hormones are
Speaker:adaptive. It's adaptive physiology. It's
Speaker:not broken physiology. Your physiology is
Speaker:responding to that state. So if you're in
Speaker:a state where there's a lot of
Speaker:inflammation in the
Speaker:body for whatever reason,
Speaker:your hormones are going to downregulate
Speaker:as a response to that. As I've said,
Speaker:they're going to adapt.(...) And I think
Speaker:people are just put onto these protocols
Speaker:far too quickly, and then they don't
Speaker:actually find any relief from their
Speaker:symptoms because the hormones aren't
Speaker:necessarily the issue.
Speaker:Well, they are, but the bigger issue is
Speaker:potentially the mitochondrial dysfunction
Speaker:being driven by the streaming mold
Speaker:infection, for example. So I think that's
Speaker:definitely something for the audience to
Speaker:consider as well, is that hormones should
Speaker:definitely be looked at, but you should
Speaker:only do it when you sort of cover all
Speaker:your other bases. And I think what's also
Speaker:maybe pertinent for the audience to know,
Speaker:the listeners to know, and you can speak
Speaker:to this more than I can, but whenever
Speaker:I've sort of, quote unquote, counseled a
Speaker:woman in this regard, and she's still
Speaker:sort of ovulating and she hasn't sort of
Speaker:got to the point where she's going
Speaker:through perimenopausal menopause yet, I
Speaker:always try and get her, I always suggest,
Speaker:I should say, that she does start to do
Speaker:some regular blood work to see where her
Speaker:hormone levels are at. Because when you
Speaker:sort of, if a woman does go into
Speaker:menopause, I've just sort of found that
Speaker:it's very hard to determine her optimal
Speaker:levels because you don't have a baseline.
Speaker:So many people just go through life,
Speaker:obviously not having an idea of what
Speaker:their hormone levels should be. And for
Speaker:men, that's easy because you've only got
Speaker:one or two variables ready to contend
Speaker:with, and that's testosterone, and how
Speaker:much is then going to aromatize will turn
Speaker:into estrogen, which you can... So
Speaker:there's only one main lever to pull,
Speaker:whereas with women, you've got
Speaker:progesterone, estrogen, and testosterone,
Speaker:and obviously, every woman is going to
Speaker:have unique levels of those hormones.
Speaker:I think the younger a woman can start
Speaker:having these levels checked. It just
Speaker:provides that longitudinal data going
Speaker:forward. So if you get to the point where
Speaker:you then choose to go onto, as a woman,
Speaker:obviously, onto HRT, you then have that
Speaker:benchmark established. It just takes so
Speaker:much of the guesswork out of trying to
Speaker:figure out what is ideal for you.
Speaker:So yeah, those are generally my feelings
Speaker:on it, and I think you also spoke to the
Speaker:longevity aspect of it. And ultimately,
Speaker:obviously, the science is divided there,
Speaker:and everybody in the longevity community
Speaker:is going to say the moment you touch
Speaker:things, "Oh, just hold on. You're going
Speaker:to just turn M2 on forever, and you're
Speaker:going to be dead in three months." And
Speaker:you know what? That might be the case.
Speaker:You might knock off a year or two at the
Speaker:end of it. But I think if you do value
Speaker:your health and you do value your health
Speaker:span, which is far more important, then
Speaker:it's, for me anyway, it's worth the
Speaker:trade-off. I'm not Brian Johnson. I'm not
Speaker:trying to sort of live forever.(...) I
Speaker:don't think he's trying to live forever,
Speaker:to be honest. But I think that's
Speaker:definitely something to consider as well.
Speaker:At the end of the day, your longevity is
Speaker:important, but it's not as important as
Speaker:your health span, the amount of time that
Speaker:you spend healthy while you're still
Speaker:alive. So I think those are obviously
Speaker:just for the listeners, just all
Speaker:important points to consider as well.
Speaker:Sonia,
Speaker:I think we've covered
Speaker:just about all of it.
Speaker:There's just so much more I would like to
Speaker:go through, but I want to
Speaker:be respectful of your time.
Speaker:What do you want to do at part two?
Speaker:We will indeed. To end off with, I've
Speaker:just got a lightning round. I'd love to
Speaker:run through with you, if that's okay,
Speaker:just some rapid-fire questions. I have
Speaker:yet to actually have a lightning round
Speaker:that was actually rapid,
Speaker:but we'll see where we get.
Speaker:But yeah, to start off with, what's the
Speaker:one woman's health myth that really needs
Speaker:to be debunked in your view?
Speaker:That periods are, it's
Speaker:normal to have a painful period.
Speaker:Okay, that was nice and
Speaker:quick. Thank you. Perfect.
Speaker:What's the single biggest mistake women
Speaker:make regarding their health?
Speaker:I would say looking for a quick fix
Speaker:instead of the underlying issue.
Speaker:Perfect. What's the one, and this is a
Speaker:controversial one, maybe,(...) the one
Speaker:nutrient every woman
Speaker:should focus more on?
Speaker:I mean, I'd say Omega's is kind of a
Speaker:well-rounded, under-consumed,
Speaker:can help with everything. I mean, we
Speaker:could go into B's and full-A's, but I'd
Speaker:say Omega's are like, "Cool, we're good.
Speaker:Every woman needs them."
Speaker:Sauna or ice bath?
Speaker:Ice bath.
Speaker:Fair enough. I thought you were going to
Speaker:say that. And cool. And the last one is,
Speaker:what's your go-to
Speaker:stress-reducing strategy for women?
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:It's, I'll give you two. I think
Speaker:breathwork and meditation can be great if
Speaker:a woman is even there, right? If someone,
Speaker:that's like, it's so annoying, Sam. I say
Speaker:like the one thing that's free is
Speaker:honestly just putting your hands on your
Speaker:heart or just like touching your arms and
Speaker:closing your eyes and just giving a
Speaker:couple deep breaths between calls before
Speaker:you have a stressful conversation. When
Speaker:you're in the car, before you're about to
Speaker:go into your house with your young kids
Speaker:running around, just stop. Just touch
Speaker:yourself for a couple minutes. Just rub
Speaker:your arms, hands on the chest, a couple
Speaker:deep breaths. And that is a free way to
Speaker:just, every time I do it, even as an
Speaker:example, I'm always like, "Oh, that felt
Speaker:so nice." It's just like a quick, free,
Speaker:easy 30 seconds to completely change the
Speaker:way your body's
Speaker:responding in that moment.
Speaker:Yeah. That sort of somatic reintegration,
Speaker:just kind of coming back into sort of
Speaker:tune into contact with yourself.
Speaker:Sonia, thank you so much for your time.
Speaker:You've been amazing.
Speaker:Where can people find you? I know,
Speaker:obviously, you're on Instagram and all of
Speaker:that, but where would you, if people do
Speaker:want to reach out,
Speaker:where can they find you?
Speaker:Instagram's really the best way. So
Speaker:through our site, it's kind of like a
Speaker:little bit, you have to go through a
Speaker:couple processes to get to talk to me
Speaker:directly. If you go to my Instagram, at
Speaker:SoniaSpill, no hyphens or anything, I
Speaker:have a link in there. You can book for a
Speaker:free discovery call, talk about what your
Speaker:case is, see if we're the right fit.
Speaker:I also have a podcast called Unnamed and
Speaker:Untamed that I did for four years. We
Speaker:have 50, 60, 70 episodes of Women's
Speaker:Health as well. And I'm always available
Speaker:for questions. People message me on
Speaker:Instagram all the time asking me
Speaker:something or, "Hey, you mentioned this
Speaker:somewhere. Where can I
Speaker:find more information?"
Speaker:I love educating, it's my space. So
Speaker:there's that. And then if you are a coach
Speaker:or you're somebody who wants to learn
Speaker:more about this space, we do educate as
Speaker:well. I'm an educator at metabolic
Speaker:mentoring university. So if you want to
Speaker:learn more about the things that we're
Speaker:talking about, "Wow, I want to bring this
Speaker:to my clients. I'm a personal trainer. I
Speaker:just want to know more for myself and I
Speaker:want to do this to help people." Great.
Speaker:We have a space for you. We have seven
Speaker:major courses that you can come in at any
Speaker:level and learn the basics all the way
Speaker:through the most advanced topics.
Speaker:Perfect. Well, be sure to link that all
Speaker:on the show notes. Thank you just so much
Speaker:for your time and your knowledge. This
Speaker:has been an amazing conversation. I look
Speaker:forward to having more in the future.
Speaker:Absolutely. Thanks, Val. Bye.
